thinking outside the box

[mellowtigger]

I am applying for tech support jobs that seem to me like really good fits, but I decided I should also be more creative and try to imagine a life-changing alternative. What if I went back to school and got a degree, so I could become an astronomer? That has always been an interest of mine. I "did" the computer world in this first career already, so now I should try something else entirely different for the next stage.

I called the realtor who helped get me into this house in 2015. He says (without having seen the place yet) that I should probably list this house at $110K and see if bidding pushes the price upwards from there. The house doesn't even need to be perfect in this hot market, because buyers will accept the small problems just to get the property. That incoming light rail project is really affecting the interest here.

I think it's conceivable that this house could be my scholarship for going back to college in the fall season. :)

I checked my mortgage online. It says I owe just under $39K on it now. I wonder if I could actually pocket a difference close to $70K, or how much in taxes/fees would disappear?

• That amount alone would be sufficient to pay for several years of studio apartment rent and tuition in Moorhead MN without needing to work-and-study at the same time. I tried that dual life long ago, and it was very bad for my mental health. I should focus just on studies.
   
• If a bidding war provides a little more money, it would be enough to buy a condo in a nearby town (4.7km / 2.9mi) and afford a few years of association fees there.  It would keep some of that wealth intact, to help when it's time to graduate.
   
• If a bidding war provides a lot more money, it would be worthwhile to investigate buying a lot near-ish (3.9km / 2.4mi) to campus and build a new "tiny house" on it. Hard to imagine that much money for this century old house, though. I'll try to remain a little more reasonable in my expectations during this brainstorm.

It sounds reasonable, though, doesn't it?  Start a second life?  I haven't flitted off into escapist fantasies, have I?

Comments

[foeclan]

The numbers seem right. Remember to factor in the realtor's commission, taxes, title transfer fees, etc.

Seems like career options might not be abundant, and they're likely to want advanced degrees, so include that in your planning.

Here are a couple of links from AAS that might help.
https://jobregister.aas.org/
https://aas.org/careers/career-in-astronomy

I recommend seeing if they'll let you test out of some requirements based on your work experience. That will save you some tuition money and time. Don't forget to transfer any credits from other classes you've taken. Also, if you have a 4-year degree already in another field (or are close to one), you may want to talk to a grad school program directly. You may be able to skip undergrad entirely and get into an MS or Ph. D program.

[mellowtigger]

Oh, I hadn't thought of spending even more years. That makes a purchase of something much more desirable, as opposed to renting.

I also hadn't thought of healthcare. With healthcare loss, I would qualify for Obamacare, which in this state means MNcare. There probably wouldn't be much of a discount, though, until I spent a whole year without any income. If I'm reading their website correctly, it would cost me about $100/month (after some mysterious $300/month rebate?).

At the moment, I feel like I have these cutoff values for potentially putting my house on the market:
$50K net profit: No, that's too risky a decision to make.
$60K net profit: Ugh, I really wish there was more money to make this decision easier.
$70K net profit: Yes. The more money, the better option when I land in Moorhead MN.

[foeclan]

I don't see Physics or Astronomy graduate programs at UMN Moorhead, either, so you may want to consider that as well. If you get your undergrad there, and want to pursue an MS or PhD, you'll need to move again.

[mellowtigger]

Argh! I chose them because they have both a planetarium and an observatory. *sigh* It didn't occur to me that they only go so far. I sure wish I would win the lottery (I'd have to play it first), so I could pay off my house, go to UofM here in Minneapolis where the new light rail will eventually take me from "my doorstep" to campus. But I don't have that kind of savings to be a student (it's expensive), and I intend never to take on student debt again. So any "back to school" plan requires selling my house.

Which means moving to Moorhead still seems like the best option. I just discovered they actually have single-person dorm rooms! That's convenient. I remember dorm noise, though. It's quaint compared to what I've lived with for the last few years here in the warzone, but I still should probably plan on off-campus life instead. I do value what solitude I can get. Fargo has a major Microsoft office, so there are professional options available if for any reason the astronomy plan falters.

I submitted my application for admission this morning. Any decision to sell my house is dependent on actually having a school to attend (although... Normandale...), so I need to settle that first. I also emailed the admissions office explaining my plan, and asking if I can delay to the spring semester easily, if it comes to that.

I received overnight the email copy of my unofficial Normandale transcript. I started this plan back in 2001. I started the precalc and calc because I didn't remember it from the first round of college. I got an "A" in both classes. It's definitely easier the 2nd time around. I started the astronomy and physics... and you see everything just suddenly stop once I finally accept (for the 2nd time, the same thing happened at Texas A&M) that I simply cannot do both work and school at the same time when the "serious" classwork starts. I have to focus only on study, which means I need a sizable scholarship fund, and this house could be it for now. Onward with the planning. :)

[foeclan]

Yeah. I went back to grad school for my MS in Computational Biology while working full time for Dell as a development lead, and it was rough. Weirdly, though, I kind of miss it. Work paid the bills and school satisfied my desire for a challenge. I was only taking a couple of classes per semester, though, so the schedule didn't kill me.

If you get a job at the U, I think you can get discounted tuition. That may be a way to go.

[zipperbear]

Mankato has a 2-year masters-degree program for Physics and Astronomy, which I think might be a better stepping stone than a bachelor's degree for an astronomy career.
https://grad.mnsu.edu/all-graduate-programs/physics-ms/

I don't recognize any of the Physics faculty at Mankato or Moorhead. Interestingly, one name seemed familiar, but I think it might be his father, Michael Rutkowski, Sr., who apparently died at age 70 in 2014, and worked at NASA until 2013 -- he started his career at NASA in 1967, then got a Stanford PhD in 1976, which is a somewhat-delayed education milestone. I don't recognize his picture, but I wouldn't know much beyond the names of NASA people who collaborated with Stanford physics projects.
https://vertipedia.vtol.org/biographies/getBiography/biographyID/89
https://www.legacy.com/obituaries/heritage/obituary.aspx?n=michael-rutkowski&pid=173043463

[zipperbear]

University of Minnesota Twin Cities supports Physics PhD students (covering tuition and stipend in exchange for research and teaching duties) for 4-5 years (but starting with a BS/BA in Physics).
https://cse.umn.edu/physics/graduate-studies
Astrophysics is similar:
https://cse.umn.edu/mifa/grad/program

Univ of Minnesota Duluth has an MS in Physics (including Astrophysics), which seems to be a 2-year program, with "most" students supported by competitive assistantships:
https://academics.d.umn.edu/academics/majors-and-minors/physics-ms
(As the folk-singer said: "Duluth is out there!")

I don't recognize anyone at Duluth, but Twin Cities has Martin Greven (who was faculty in the Applied Physics department at Stanford, so I barely knew him), and Patrick Kelly (who was technically a Physics grad student but did his research at SLAC and KIPAC, so I recognize his photo but don't really know him).

[mellowtigger]

Thank you. Your links and history are helpful. :) I don't remember the math, unfortunately. I never needed any of it for business programming or tech support. I'll need to start those classes yet again to make it fresh before I get into the physics. And that still requires a self-made scholarship, so it's all moot until I talk to the realtor on Wednesday evening.

I just downloaded my unofficial transcript from the 1st round of college back in 1986+. I got up to a few semi-serious classes in my first calendar year...
Math 152 Engineering Math II (B)
Math 253 Engineering Math III (C)
Phys 208 Electricity And Optics (B)

... before the very clear and very dramatic terribleness begins. Bad times ensue for years of painful decline. I wish my psych evals went on that transcript too, so it has a proper context. No more simultaneous working and schooling for me. It was a combination of that and not having my autism diagnosis until years later. Those symptoms just weren't in the DSM III at the time. I'm much better prepared, knowing what I know now about me and humanity. I backed off work-and-school at Normandale long before I reached anything like that previous level of stress. Still dipped my toes into it, though, so... no simultaneous working and schooling. That's the rule now.

[zipperbear]

I'm just not sure that schooling will be worth the cost (in money, time, and disruption). Undergrad degrees aren't very valuable in astronomy, which is also a very small job market. Graduate degrees are significant, especially for academia (which is a big chunk of the astronomy jobs), but there are technicians, programmers, and tech support staff with work experience rather than degrees, who are making valuable contributions. Conversely, there are glass ceilings between faculty, tenured faculty, and everyone else, which complicates the budgeting and funding for collaborations (mostly under research grants).

In every field, it's hard to find good workers who are productive, pleasant to work with, enthusiastic, etc., but those are hard traits to measure. Instead, a college degree shows that you're smart enough to pass exams and navigate some bureaucracy.

If you can get a start somewhere that's a good fit for your talents, then (unless it's a toxic or dysfunctional workplace) you'd be valued and encouraged to grow into more advanced roles. Getting your foot in the door somewhere to get on-the-job experience is often better than book-learning. In some sense, that's also the whole point of grad school assistantships, to get practice with teaching, research, and paperwork, which are all skills useful in academia, industry, or government.

In an interview, maybe emphasize that you want out of a dull job with no advancement room, and that you want something productive, interesting, and good for humanity. They say you should focus on the positive, not bad-mouthing a job you hate. (Disclaimer: I've never actually gotten a job that I've interviewed for. As a temp, I got several offers to stay on. The one where I agreed to try it, for at least a year, turned into 28 years.)

[mtbc]

Definitely assume you'll need more money that you expected. I'm sure glad I did that for this move, given the myriad issues with this house that the inspection didn't report, today the guy's replacing rotten-wood parts of the "new roof". I had other plans for the post-purchase remainder of the capital, sigh.

I sure don't want you to dissuade you from chasing your passion but definitely look hard at the resulting career options so you have a good idea where you'll end up, i.e., very plausibly not as a comfortably paid astronomer.

[mellowtigger]

Yes, renting is good for eliminating those particular headaches. There's still the issue of rising rent, so maybe everything is just a complicated trade off. If campus had a dorm just for older students (who are much quieter) it could be a good thing to get a single room there, but I only just discovered this morning that single-person dorms are even a thing.

[foeclan]

When I went to UMD, there were single-person dorms, but they were planted in the middle of all the others, so they weren't any quieter. In fact, the loudest person in my section was in a single-person door that he filled with speakers.

[danieldwilliam]

When does the light rail system arrive?

[zipperbear]

It'll be some years away, presumably after the other extension, planned to open in 2024:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southwest_LRT

It's less far along in planning, and they plan to settle on a final alignment by the end of 2021, but they still need new engineering and environmental impact reports:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bottineau_LRT#Opposition,_realignment

[danieldwilliam]

Thanks.

My guess is that there will be more impact on property prices the closer to opening the line is.

I have a house that is going to be conveniently located near to a new commuter station in to Edinburgh which is due to open in about two years. It turns the town from not a commuter town in to a commuter town. Not seeing a huge impact on house prices yet.

[mellowtigger]

I think you are right. Probably actual homebuyers would pay more to buy this house after the line is functional. Right now, I suspect it's all the prospectors (property flippers) who are buying at this early stage. Probably the sanest course of action would be for me to find a new and intellectually stimulating job to "tide me over" for a few years, pay off the house, then reconsider school. Not waiting too many more years, though. Nobody has any guarantees, but already I'm well into my grey beard years.

[danieldwilliam]

If I were in a similar position to you, in a British city (where I understood the property dynamics and future interest rate trajectory better) I would be inclined to wait a year. Maybe two. Give myself a chance to pick exactly the right course, build up some reserves, pay down the mortgage a bit more and in the expectation that the property price would go up a little as the plans for the light rail get closer to fruition and COVID receeds.

But there is something to be said for just going and having an adventure right now.

And how great to be able to enjoy thinking about it.

[danieldwilliam]

USian mortgages seem differently structured to UK ones.

A colleague and friend of mine in Seattle just told me that he renegotiated his fixed-term mortgage and has reduced the term of the mortgage from 30 years to 15 years with repayments at the same amount just as a result of the reduction in interest rates.

In the UK I don't think I would get a 30 year mortgage at the age of 45 (he's older than I am) and the longest fixed-term mortgage would be 5 years (5 years at a fixed interest rate, + X years after at a variable rate but you can re-mortgage).